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TOPIC: Sequencing lessons breakdown.

Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 8 months ago #25241

  • Mick
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Dirters,

You know how you can watch an instruction video, and you just cant take it all in. You forget so much.

Well, I went through the sequencing lesson videos and have written a dot point break down for ease of reference. It may be confusing to those who havent watched the videos. It mostly concerns set up consideration.

Also, if Ive interpreted or recorded anything incorrectly, please inform me so i can ammend the accuracy of this information.

Hope it helps!!


Sequence lesson breakdown

Address
- At address plant the front foot at 45 degrees and the back foot at 20.
- Bend knees and drop weight into the ground through the ankles, get into the ground!!
- Pull knees together to create pressure inside of the legs.
- Right arm at level 1 pressure (*See below for pressure level explanation)

Tailbone considerations.
- It’s all about controlling the centre.
- Controlling the tailbone will give you the best contact.
- The legs control the tailbone. Position of tailbone, must dictate position of hips.
- There are ‘4’ specific movement of the tailbone in the sequence.

Club head takeaway
- Commence club head takeaway by pushing up and straightening rear leg slightly and;
- In tandem with rear leg action, front knee bends in towards the ball.
- This movement will cause the tailbone to tilt forward,
so the body should feel centred over the ball. This first tailbone
movement is known as the ‘1st inch movement’ and is maintained
and held during the backswing.

- Right hip must stay inside rear ankle during backswing and follow through.
- Right arm adopts level 2 pressure during first part of takeaway.
- At top of backswing, pressure level returns to level 1.

Downswing
- Activate downswing by moving front knee forward across the line of the foot and over the toes.
- Maintain rear leg position during this initial move.
- This movement allows for the ‘2 inch’ gain in tailbone forward movement.
- In tandem with the front knee move, right elbow moves into right hip, pressure level 3.
- Should feel pressure inside left foot.
- As your hands come down, begin straightening right arm and twirl hands to allow the straightening and alignment of the wrists.
- Activate right side. Kick/drop into hitting position with your right ankle and knee moving forward.
- ‘3rd inch’ gain as hips start to move forward prior to hitting.
- Straighten left arm and HIT THE BALL, bringing hips through.
- Follow through hitting zone into finishing position.
- ‘4th inch gain’ as you push the hips through post strike.

*Pressure ranking (Pressure of right arm against body)

1 - Pressure just under armpit
2 - Pressure under armpit and elbow
3 - Pressure under armpit, elbow and some forearm inclusion.

Regards,

Mick B)
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 8 months ago #25339

  • Dave Medlock
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Good job there Mick, I've been following this instruction closely over the past months, unable to get outside and hit balls due to the weather. Actually the confinement may be beneficial to take these movements and thoughts piece by piece over time.
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 8 months ago #25395

  • kenan
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Mick man,

Thanks for compiling this list. I'd like to offer an amendment to the intent of the list of moves.

These moves are the result of successfully executing the proper setup, takeaway, and transition sequences. After transition as your body begins moving toward the ball it is hopeless to try to control the club or any other part of the body with any muscular actions. The downswing will feel as described in the list but only because you properly execute the correct setup, takeaway, and transition.

Take it from somebody who's been trying to hit positions on his downswing (this guy), it is a dead end. The downswing list is an explanation of what happens, it's not something we can try to do. If we try to control the downswing we are asking for trouble.

Also I think we need to be sure to consider the reactionary forces taking place throughout the swing. I'm primarily thinking about this part:

"Activate downswing by moving front knee forward across the line of the foot and over the toes. This movement allows for the ‘2 inch’ gain in tailbone forward movement."

To do that critical move we have to transfer some energy from our back leg/foot. The left knee reacts to energy flowing from our posted right leg. The result is that we should feel some kind of pressure in our right foot during this critical transition move. Can't "pull" energy with our left foot if it has no weight on it. The weight's on the back foot mostly.

Elk talks with Dilfer about throwing a football. The action of throwing something involves this transfer of energy from back to front foot. The image of throwing something and staying balanced helped me tremendously to feel the correct foot action in my swing.

Cheers,
Kenan
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 8 months ago #25423

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Thanks Kenan,

Some clarification on my behalf may be benificial, however, it is simply my interpretation so dont take it as the gospel ;)

**

"Activate downswing by moving front knee forward across the line of the foot and over the toes. This movement allows for the ‘2 inch’ gain in tailbone forward movement."

To do that critical move we have to transfer some energy from our back leg/foot. The left knee reacts to energy flowing from our posted right leg. The result is that we should feel some kind of pressure in our right foot during this critical transition move. Can't "pull" energy with our left foot if it has no weight on it. The weight's on the back foot mostly.

**

ElK mentioned that you shouldnt allow the hip to move too far foward during this move, and that your foot shoudnt go left, but over the foot and toes at the angle defined during address (45). When practicing myself, i noted that if i allowed my knee to go left and outside the front foot, the pressure was felt more predominately in the rear foot due to being too far forward. If my knee went over the front foot, the pressure inside was maintained on the inside front foot, so the absence of inner front foot pressure can highlight an issue. This isnt to say there is no pressure in the right leg.

The pressure you build in your legs during setup, specifically in the rear leg, is essentially maintained and not lost, so you will always feel right leg pressure, but incorrect sequencing can allow different pressure sensations in the front foot which is what we need to be aware of.

You must build and improve on your position over the ball, you have to change your spine angle to allow for better contact. This move is for that purpose. Remember, this is simply for the 'activation' of the downswing.

When i executed this properly, my swing felt very compact and effortless, which is what i think your trying to describe.

Having said all that, I have a hc of 11. What do i know!!!! Perhaps the man himself could chime in and see if we're on the right track.

:)
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 8 months ago #25439

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Yeah dude. I'm just trying to think logically about this. If our body moves left, we have to push off the right side. If our backswing goes right, we'll have weight on our right side. Any moves left will necessitate some form of energy transfer from right to left at the transition from backswing to downswing.

I'm not sure what my handicap is but I'm pretty sure you're better than me. Went to the course this weekend and choked it up bad. Never hit so many topped/panicked/grabby shots in my life. I'm learning faster than I'm improving and that's ok I think.
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 8 months ago #25443

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If our body moves left, we have to push off the right side. If our backswing goes right, we'll have weight on our right side. Any moves left will necessitate some form of energy transfer from right to left at the transition from backswing to downswing.

I think of it as more of a tilt of weight. As you push up slightly from the right during the start of your backswing, your weight goes onto the inside front foot, however, your rear leg position is maintained until its later activation.

Its all in the spine/hips. Your first move back, using the legs, places you tailbone in a forward slant pointing back at the ball. This is all important. You cant get that position by putting your all your weight back.

As the man said, tailbone position dictates how good your impact will be.

Also, instead of thinking about weight, think about torque and the pressure you build using torque instead of weight. When you bring those knees in at address, you will feel the pressure on the inside of your legs, just as Hogan said also.

Confused. Me too, and often. :P Its all a learning curve and nobodys right but there are lots who almost are. If they knew everything we wouldnt be on this site!!!!
Last Edit: 2 years 8 months ago by Mick . Reason: spelling correction
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #32719

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Can someone tell me where the weight is at setup and are the shoulders level like stackntilt or is there a secondary axis tilt?
Thanks
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #32720

  • Chris Graham
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Mike, Great job on the check list very comprehensive and should help plenty.

Here's “my” check list that I've been going through recently, I only tend to work on one section at a time at this stage, I'm a little dim i'm afraid. :P

Prepare, = Your grip, stance, posture, waggle, Head inclination.
These are the keys to the chain of events, get these right and rest happens automatically.

Initiate, = First move, tail bone moves 1”. Half way back with the right elbow folding (if your grips correct it has no other option but to fold) weight centred covering the ball.

Delivery = Target knee and right elbow fire into position and everything follows quiet happily. If you have any thought's at this point, don't be afraid to hit down.

Cheers Chris
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33013

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Can someone explain this for me? In the wrist cock video PK says the hands go straight back not out and not in but straight.
Then on the Hands Inside video he says hands go in and shows a very inside takeaway.
Can somebody clear this up for me?
Thanks
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33017

  • Terry Okura
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Hey Bob,

Because it's a straight plane, they "feel" like they go straight back, but because it's on an incline plane, in actuality they go inside. Hope that helps.

Terry
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33024

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Terry


Thanks, That helps alot. Can you tell me about set-up, is it with level shoulders like SnT or reverse K.
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33032

  • John Hue
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Bob

Paul recommends the weight in the middle of the feet. He puts his hands on his hips and flexes the knees but wants his hands dropping vertically ,there is no backside out deal with him. He has the knees pressed in slightly and braced and held. This brings the weight to the insteps of the feet but still in the middle. He describes his legs as loaded and ready to go.
The Lower Back is bent 15* forward from the waist, he then drops his upper back further which enables a tilted shoulder turn. The neck is dropped further forward and the head tilted slightly away from the target.He wants you looking directly at the ball but sightly from the inside.
The left shoulder is slightly higher than the right at address (5* spine tilt away from the target). It looks pretty close to the Hogan set up to me. There is no big move off the ball with a lot of lean away from the target. It is a rotary on top of the ball backswing.
To help you get a visual idea it looks to me that Steve Elkington pretty well adheres completely to Mr Kopp's address. The only variation I can detect is that Steve squares off his right foot and Paul likes it flared out 10* with the left flared out 25* to 45* depending on your personal flexability.
Last Edit: 2 years 4 months ago by John Hue.
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33042

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John

Thanks, Yeah 5degrees tilt is same as SnT. I like the feel of this set up better than SnT. Its a much tighter coil with feet and knees in this position. I probably dont get as big of turn since its more restricted but it seems to make the down swing more automatic because your not as loose. With SnT setup feet and knees flaird I feel like I can turn for ever but cant get the down swing started. Does this make any since?
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33043

  • John Hue
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Bob


You get plenty of turn it is not restricted but not loose either. The right leg straightens in the backswing you don't sit on a flexed knee which would restrict the backswing. Also as you get towards the top of the backswing you straighten up the upper back from it's forward lean but this is dropped back in in the downstroke. So it is not a restricted pivot but a full one.But with any motion you can internally control the amount of muscle winding the back swing it self won't do that for you.
Instruction wise The Sequence is the best money I have ever spent. It is far more than just a roadmap of his swing. The excercises do the building for you,but you have to do them to get full value. I wish I had this years ago it would have saved me huge amounts of time and effort.I get more out of his excercises than I do hitting balls. His swing to me is basically a Hogan like double shift but not only is it described but the excercises get you doing the right things so that it falls in place by it self or as Paul says the swing gets revealed to you.
Last Edit: 2 years 4 months ago by John Hue.
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33046

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If the tailbone is always moving forward doesnt that mean there is no Wt. shift to the rear leg other than mabe the wt of club and arms?
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33048

  • John Hue
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Just by turning around the 5* spine lean is going to move the weight into the right side. The most weight in the right side is most likely around the time the arms get level with the ground in the backswing.
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33049

  • svsvincenzo
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All of these are just rehashed MORAD stuff...
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33051

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svsvincenzo. I have never seen a full description of the MORAD swing. Is it just a single method? I have seen MORAD swings but don't know what Mac O'Gradyteaches . Your post indicates that Mr Kopp's swing is a MORAD copy. Are there differences between them in your opinion?
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33052

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Has anyone got any good links to an in depth description of Morad? Thanks
Last Edit: 2 years 4 months ago by John Hue.
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33053

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Not even Mac will talk about his swing. How would anybody know what he does? Hes still hiding out in Palm Springs and wont share his ideas with anyone. At least we share ideas but I would agree its a Mac Ogrady type wrist cock but alot of swings use this type.
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33072

  • Dan Lunn
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svsvincenzo wrote:
All of these are just rehashed MORAD stuff...

Hey svsv, have you got a breakdown of Mac's stuff?

Having studied these principles, them appear quite similar to certain principles of certain martial arts.
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33134

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John Hue wrote:
Has anyone got any good links to an in depth description of Morad? Thanks

The SnT book is the closest, though SnT is I believe the CF pattern. There's the CP pattern, and there's the inline.
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33164

  • 1lovegolf24
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Mr. Hue,

You may find some intersting info here.

perfectgolfswingreview.net/

Good Luck and Keep Diggin

Mark, 1lovegolf24
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33591

  • JesseV
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There are certain people, persons, who comes to this site and other sites who then piss on your leg and then try to tell you its raining.

I wouldn't put a lot of stock in anything they have to say. This site and others are littered with their junk.

Looks like Paul Kopp and Elk have something worthwhile to show and teach us all. Take it for what it is and learn from it, or don't, thats up to you, Don't try to ruin if for the rest of us because you don't know whats going on, or you have some narcissistic notion that you are a golfing god and you always have to prove yourself right in every thread on every subject, half wit.

As far as I'm concerned if you don't have anything constructive to say then you should hold your tongue and keep your half baked sarcasms and pseudo observations to yourself. You only perpetuate the belief that you are a Bonehead.
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Re: Sequencing lessons breakdown. 2 years 4 months ago #33593

  • Dan Lunn
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JesseV wrote:
There are certain people, persons, who comes to this site and other sites who then piss on your leg and then try to tell you its raining.

I wouldn't put a lot of stock in anything they have to say. This site and others are littered with their junk.

Looks like Paul Kopp and Elk have something worthwhile to show and teach us all. Take it for what it is and learn from it, or don't, thats up to you, Don't try to ruin if for the rest of us because you don't know whats going on, or you have some narcissistic notion that you are a golfing god and you always have to prove yourself right in every thread on every subject, half wit.

As far as I'm concerned if you don't have anything constructive to say then you should hold your tongue and keep your half baked sarcasms and pseudo observations to yourself. You only perpetuate the belief that you are a Bonehead.

Hey Jesse - I quite agree - to whom do you refer?
Last Edit: 2 years 4 months ago by Dan Lunn. Reason: missed a word
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